Recommendations for sump pump alarm

[stealle]

I'd like some suggestions for a sump pump alarm.  My preference would be a float switch that would cause an alarm when the water level gets too high in the sump (indicating the sump pump failed). I'd like to get a text in the even the water level goes high. An audible alarm would be good too.  I don't care if the solution is Insteon or Z-wave or whatever. I just want whatever is the most reliable. 

[apostolakisl]

There are a bunch of off-the-shelf float switches out there.  Just do a nice secure installation and you should be good.  From there, you can hook the float switch to an i/o linc and program ISY to do whatever you want.  You can also wire it up to a siren directly so if for whatever reason the i/o linc/ISY/email thing failed, you would still have that whining siren.

Other fun options include using an ultrasonic range finder and wiring that up to a cai webcontrol.  There is  a node server for cai webcontrol posted by ioguy which will allow easy isy integration.  This will tell you exactly where the water level is.  Basically, it outputs a voltage based on the distance between the device and the reflection surface (the water).  ISY would show the voltage and then you would need to scale that number to inches or whatever.

And another thing is to use an synchrolinc on your sump pumps electric plug.  From this you can be notified if there is too much or too little run time.

EDIT:  It seems that synchrolincs are no longer a thing.  Anybody know anything about that?  Is there going to be a new device replacing it or is this just never to be a thing again?

Edited August 23, 2018 by apostolakisl

[gregf]

I went with pumpalarm.com completely stand alone. Sends a text using a cell modem. Works and notifies you if the power goes out. Pretty much bullet proof.

Edited August 24, 2018 by gregf

[MWareman]

I have the Basement Watchdog redundant sump system. Two pumps (different heights - 110v primary and 12v secondary), 4 floats (interleaved - so a failed float normally doesn’t completely take a pump out of contention) and dual power supply (110v and a deep cycle lead acid).

The charge controller has a dry contact output that I have wired to my Elk (as a non-alarm zone) - and it drives my ISY.

I had a float stick on a couple of months ago - caused the 110v pump to stay on and burn out during a storm. The battery pump handled the load and the system alerted me once the battery pump came on (about 10 mins after the 110v pump finally failed). I was able to replace the float and pump the next day without getting any water in the basement.

Without the alert - I likely would not have known about the float failure for quite a while - putting my finished basement at risk.

A great system.

I recently added a current sensing relay to the 110v pump power supply - and have the dry contact of that going to another Elk non-alarm zone. I use that (with some ISY programs) to track runtime of the pump and correlate it with the Weatherflow rain sensor. That’s another way I intend to detect possible failures.

[apostolakisl]

The absolutely easiest solution is this

 

https://www.smarthome.com/insteon-2852-222-water-leak-sensor.html

 

Mount this in the well at a level above which you would like to be notified.  No wires, no power, no nothing.  Just link it to your isy and write some programs.  You can even get 2 or 3 and mount them at different locations as redundancy.

I don't have any ground water issues (my well is 800 feet deep!) and have no sump, but to mitigate any pipe/appliance leakage I put gri2600 http://www.grisk.com/images/product_pdfs/liquid_detection/2600_12volt_dc_water_sensor.pdf water monitoring all over my house, about 20 sensors maybe more.  They are all wired directly into my Elk.  GRI also makes a submersible water presence sensor.  http://www.grisk.com/images/product_pdfs/liquid_detection/2808_absence_water_sensor.pdf This would be ideal to put just below the pump shut off level.  If that sensor goes dry, it would either indicate drought, or a pump that has failed to shut off.  These sensors will require that you get an io linc or wire into a security panel or similar.

The GRI unit saved me huge already.  I had a slow leak behind the dishwasher that was running water under the hardwood floor.  The leak detector sensed it even though there was no water evidence at all.  I cursed the water sensor as having failed and reluctantly pulled the dishwasher out.  And then, I stopped cursing it and started cursing the plumber.

Edited August 24, 2018 by apostolakisl

[stealle]

1 hour ago, apostolakisl said:

The absolutely easiest solution is this

 

https://www.smarthome.com/insteon-2852-222-water-leak-sensor.html

Thanks for the suggestions guys.  I hope to hear more suggestions...

Here are my thoughts.  I have invested in the ISY994ZW so I'd like a solution that uses it.  Many of the proprietary stand alone solutions require yet another monthly/yearly subscription to get text message notifications.  I'm sick of subscribing to monthly subscriptions.  It would be nice to use the ISY that I already have to do that.  Perhaps the I/o link apostolakisl suggested in the second post is the solution.  I'll have a look at those.

The most obvious solution seems to be the Insteon 2852-222 water leak sensor, but that sensor doesn't make sense to me.  It appears to be a self sacrificing module since it's not water proof.  It would be difficult to mount this inside the sump pit.  Which is what I want so I can be notified as soon as the sump pump fails, not after it has already flooded onto the floor above the sump pit.  If I do manage to mount it inside the pit the water level will rise to the point of destroying the 2852-222.  Unless I'm missing something here, it seems like there should be wire leads from the 2852-222 that rest on the floor or inside the sump so the 2852-222 can be kept in a remote dry location.

 

[apostolakisl]

36 minutes ago, stealle said:

 

With the io linc, you can use the GRI sensors.  GRI is a security system "industry standard"  Very well respected.  Just make sure you have good com with your io linc since they are not dual band.  Maybe consider putting a lamplinc on the same outlet with it if there is any question about it.  The iolinc only has a single input, so you will not be able to independently monitor more than one sensor at a time (with only 1 iolinc).  Though you can have multiple sensors that run in parralel or series (depending on if you get the NO or NC leak detector).  If you want power outage protection, you'll need to put it on a ups and then you will have to have a dual band device since the ups will block the power line com.

Edited August 24, 2018 by apostolakisl

[mmb]

3 hours ago, apostolakisl said:

With the io linc, you can use the GRI sensors.  GRI is a security system "industry standard"  Very well respected.  Just make sure you have good com with your io linc since they are not dual band.  Maybe consider putting a lamplinc on the same outlet with it if there is any question about it.  The iolinc only has a single input, so you will not be able to independently monitor more than one sensor at a time (with only 1 iolinc).  Though you can have multiple sensors that run in parralel or series (depending on if you get the NO or NC leak detector).  If you want power outage protection, you'll need to put it on a ups and then you will have to have a dual band device since the ups will block the power line com.

I use GRI sensors in combination with my DSC alarm which is connected to my ISY.   A couple of years ago it caught a failed sump pump and saved me from a big cleanup...

[apostolakisl]

51 minutes ago, mmb said:

I use GRI sensors in combination with my DSC alarm which is connected to my ISY.   A couple of years ago it caught a failed sump pump and saved me from a big cleanup...

No doubt, hard wiring into a real UL listed security panel is the gold standard.  If linked to ISY, you can both have a proper security panel call to central station as well as an ISY initiated action (ie email, text).  That is what I have done.  I get notifications by text as well as getting a call from central station.

[DennisC]

I have about 8 GRI sensors wired up to my Elk panel also. Very reliable and effective. I have received several early notifications from my system and was very great full for the warning.

[mmb]

20 hours ago, apostolakisl said:

No doubt, hard wiring into a real UL listed security panel is the gold standard.  If linked to ISY, you can both have a proper security panel call to central station as well as an ISY initiated action (ie email, text).  That is what I have done.  I get notifications by text as well as getting a call from central station.

I forgo the central monitoring as I found the ISY was sufficient for "central" monitoring and it avoids a monthly charge.  The ISY notifies all the important people of a device failure.  Of course everything is on a UPS.

[apostolakisl]

1 minute ago, mmb said:

I forgo the central monitoring as I found the ISY was sufficient for "central" monitoring and it avoids a monthly charge.  The ISY notifies all the important people of a device failure.  Of course everything is on a UPS.

Generally speaking, an alarm system is required by local code to be monitored by a central station.  If you don't have a siren, perhaps not, since no one will ever know if it goes off.  But there are plenty of times when I am not going to get a text or an email immediately.  Or perhaps I'm being held at gunpoint and the intruder isn't keen on me calling the police.  I think that central station is worth it for the $120/year.