A Number of Insteon Devices State Changes no Longer Being "Seen" Correctly by EISY

[Michaelco]

Problem extends to a number of Insteon devices no longer working as they have for years.  The first device which I noticed not working correctly yesterday was the Insteon 2455 I/O Linc.  I'm using it on an entrance gate - the input monitors the safety and exit loops change of state, and the output controls opening and closing the gates remotely.  I had thought it was failing, after seeing odd behavior - no longer getting indications when someone drives over the loops - I can open and close the gates using UD Mobile, but even the closing behavior is odd.  The gates close, but a few minutes later they reopen.

I was going to replace the I/O Linc today, until I saw other things not working correctly.  Last night I turned on the outside lights.  I use the Insteon 2477D SwitchLinc Dimmer, to turn on the Entry Porch lights.  I have EISY code to turn on other outside lights if the Entry Porch light SwitchLinc is pressed two times within 3 seconds.  This no longer works - the entry porch light turns on, however the other lights that would normally come on with a second tap of the rocker switch, ... don't.  I have another switch that controls lights in the kitchen which uses the same function - i.e., a single tap of the switch rocker turns on the light that's connected to the switch, but the second tap is ignored.

I looked at the event log, and the switch actions don't appear when operating either the porch switch, or the kitchen switch.  The even log shows switch activity when I turn on the switch via UD Mobile.  Another oddity occurs when I access menu item from the ISY Console "Show PLM Links Table".  It's been a while since I've used it, so I may not be doing something correctly, but nothing is displayed when I click on the Start button.

I could believe there is a problem with the PLM, but even this doesn't explain the situation - as, I have control of all the switches via UD Mobile.

Any help on this would be appreciated.

[paulbates]

I'm leaning towards plm, mainly if your links table is empty. You could try unplugging the plm, waiting 10 seconds and plugging back in.

If that works it's partial confirmation that the plm is dying.

How old is the plm?

[Michaelco]

2 hours ago, paulbates said:

I'm leaning towards plm, mainly if your links table is empty. You could try unplugging the plm, waiting 10 seconds and plugging back in.

If that works it's partial confirmation that the plm is dying.

How old is the plm?

Thank you.
I had unplugged the PLM, but only waited  couple seconds before plugging back in. 
The plm is old enough that it could be it, but wouldn’t I have had a problem with the EISY communicating with the Insteon devices via the console, or UD Mobile? 
I don’t know the internals of the PLM nor how the table is structured/used, but I can control the devices from the console. 

I just unplugged the plm and waited around 30 seconds - still no entries PLM Links Table.

Before doing the plugging/unplugging I tried to control the kitchen lights via the console and noticed the device status didn’t show the lights being on, even though they had turned on.  I retried this after plugging the PLM back in, and the status reflected correctly.  

So, I’ll try a new PLM - is it as simple as choosing “Restore Modem(PLM)” from the file menu?

[Techman]

@Michaelco

Try doing a "restore devices". This will write the all the device link tables to the plm.  If you have any battery operated devices then disable automatic write to battery devices before you do the restore.

[Michaelco]

1 hour ago, Techman said:

@Michaelco

Try doing a "restore devices". This will write the all the device link tables to the plm.  If you have any battery operated devices then disable automatic write to battery devices before you do the restore.

Thank you for the suggestion.  

Where is the setting to disable automatic write to battery devices?  And, can I restore a single device.  Thought I could have restored one of the devices not having the behaviors programmed, and not have to worry about the battery'd device issue.  But, not sure a restore can be done on a single device - can it?  My hesitation is because of the confirmation dialog.

When I select "Restore Device" from the context menu (while on a device I want to restore), I get a confirmation dialog (attached) which says it will reprogram your INSTEON Devices using the settings stored in loX.  Is it just the selected device, or all devices.  I know I can select multiple devices and choose "Restore Device" from the menu - then the reference to Devices (plural) fits what I'd be doing - but.

[Techman]

You can restore the link table to an individual device by right clicking on the device then left click on "restore device". This only writes the link table to the device, not the plm

I've attached a page from the ISY Cookbook which defines the restore process.

ISY Cookbook 45.pdfISY Cookbook 45.pdfISY Cookbook 45.pdfISY Cookbook 45.pdfISY Cookbook 45.pdfISY Cookbook 45.pdfISY Cookbook 45.pdf

 

 

Edited September 8 by Techman

[bw23198]

Oddly enough something similar happened to me.  But in my case, eISY can't see any of my Insteon devices.  All the device status are blank.  And when I try to turn on my closet light (for example), I get an error message about my Rachio sprinkler system.  
All I can think of is that I recently added a new PG3 ratgdo module yesterday in slot 13 of my eISY.  (I hesitated at first; thinking slot 13 wasn't a good choice.  Maybe I should have listed to my gut!)

I'm still trying to figure out exactly what the behavior is, but as of now all of my Insteon devices are unreachable. 

-Brian

[bw23198]

Ok, false alarm I guess.  Unplugging and replugging in the PLM fixed it.  My Insteon devices are now online and responding.  I guess my PLM just got worn out and needed a swift kick in the rear.

 

-Brian

[Techman]

@bw23198

It's possible that your PLM is faiing. Check to make sure the green led on the PLM is on. Depending on how old your PLM is, it might be need to be replaced. Some of the older PLMs had a tendency to fail after a few years. 

 

[paulbates]

8 hours ago, paulbates said:

If that works it's partial confirmation that the plm is dying.

Per @Techmancomments, and mine above... replugging has bought you the time to order a new one and install...

NOW is a really good time to make a backup

[Michaelco]

57 minutes ago, Techman said:

@bw23198

It's possible that your PLM is faiing. Check to make sure the green led on the PLM is on. Depending on how old your PLM is, it might be need to be replaced. Some of the older PLMs had a tendency to fail after a few years. 

 

It's more than 5 years old, probably closer to 10.

I see instructions on replacing a PLM connected to an ISY.  The guide for the EISY has a link pointing to the ISY instructions which starts by saying "Unplug ISY from the power outlet" - this works for an ISY, but is problematic with an EISY.  So, I'm thinking of

• Disconnecting the old PLM from the EISY,
• Unplug old PLM
• Plug in the new PLM, but don't initially connect to EISY 
• Reboot the EISY,
• Connect the EISY to the new PLM
• Restore Modem(PLM) from the Admin Console "File" menu

Is there a better way to replace a PLM with EISY?

[Michaelco]

4 minutes ago, paulbates said:

Per @Techmancomments, and mine above... replugging has bought you the time to order a new one and install...

NOW is a really good time to make a backup

I have a spare on hand, and latest backup is current.  Just want to make sure I swap out the PLM in a reasonable way.

[Techman]

@Michaelco

You need to exactly follow the attached instructions

Replace Modem (eisy_polisy).pdf

[Michaelco]

23 minutes ago, Techman said:

@Michaelco

You need to exactly follow the attached instructions

 

Thanks for the instructions.

I just finished swapping out the the PLM, and checked the operation of a number of devices.  So far, all devices are working correctly, and the EISY is logging in complete device communications.  The only substitution I did to the procedure in the pdf you provided was to reboot the EISY instead of pulling power.  I'm surprised the process suggest to remove power.

[bw23198]

1 hour ago, Techman said:

@bw23198

It's possible that your PLM is faiing. Check to make sure the green led on the PLM is on. Depending on how old your PLM is, it might be need to be replaced. Some of the older PLMs had a tendency to fail after a few years. 

 

I did notice the light was off before I unplugged it.  It came back on when I plugged it back in.  
This PLM is quite old (at least 8yrs) and has been rock solid.  It's the 2413s model.  When I purchased it, I think it was either required or preferred for ISY994.  

Is that still the recommended PLM, or is the 2413U a better option?  Most of my network is Insteon dual band devices.

[Techman]

For the EISY you should use the 2413U

It uses a standard USB cable to connect to the EISY. The 2413S also works but it requires a USB to SERIAL adapter cable

[Geddy]

1 hour ago, Michaelco said:

I'm surprised the process suggest to remove power.

The original instructions (from the wiki) were written for the older ISY devices (99/994). Those devices didn’t have a reboot process so pulling power was the only way to “reboot” them. 

Just know that the eisy can boot quickly so if the PLM isn’t settled as the eisy boots it could result in a “not connected” state and the eisy might need another reboot. Thus, when changing the modem it might still be advised to unplug the eisy and make sure the PLM is powered and stable before booting the eisy. 

 

[Michaelco]

17 hours ago, Geddy said:

Just know that the eisy can boot quickly so if the PLM isn’t settled as the eisy boots it could result in a “not connected” state and the eisy might need another reboot. Thus, when changing the modem it might still be advised to unplug the eisy and make sure the PLM is powered and stable before booting the eisy. 

 

So, how would I know if the Restore Modem(PLM) worked correctly when I relied on plugging in the PLM at the time of the EISY reboot?  Is repeating Restore Modem(PLM) with unplugging the EISY, feasible and useful to correct any issues if I hadn't plugged in the PLM in time?

Edited September 9 by Michaelco

[Geddy]

45 minutes ago, Michaelco said:

 Is repeating Restore Modem(PLM) with unplugging the EISY, feasible and useful to correct any issues if I hadn't plugged in the PLM in time?

No, don't keep attempting to restore the PLM. If it didn't help the first time it might cause issue in repeating. 

It's always been the suggestion of proper booting/powering up to have the PLM plugged in prior to any ISY/Polisy/eisy device. Plug in the PLM, wait "a little bit" (the light might flicker when first powered up). Once the light is green and steady then power up your controller device. Allow that to fully boot (for eisy could take 1-2 minutes+/-, possibly more if you have a very large system). Then log into admin console. If it's not in safe mode then the PLM should be connected correctly. 

From there you should troubleshoot any issues you still have.

Troubleshooting steps for reference:

https://wiki.universal-devices.com/index.php?title=ISY-99i/ISY-26_INSTEON:Troubleshooting_Flowchart#

They're written for the ISY99/994 era, but still relate to Polisy/eisy for most items to check/confirm for troubleshooting with Insteon.

If you're still having issues I would suggest opening a ticket with UD to get further assistance:

https://www.universal-devices.com/my-tickets/

It's quite possible that something else changed in your installation that is causing poor communication with the PLM to devices in different areas and causing issues with connections to the device at your entry gate.

Good luck. If you do open a support ticket please post back what resolves the issue to it might help others in the future.