lilyoyo1 Posted June 14, 2019 Posted June 14, 2019 5 minutes ago, Blackbird said: I guess what i mean by future proof is, when the polyisy is capable of being a stand alone "isy", will the current models (hardware wise) be all we would need. Thanks He already stated it has what it needs to be a full controller and that's they've been testing for over a year.
Blackbird Posted June 15, 2019 Author Posted June 15, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, lilyoyo1 said: He already stated it has what it needs to be a full controller and that's they've been testing for over a year. I would rather not read between the lines when deciding to buy. For all I know that year was spent testing the software not the hardware. But thanks for the input. Edited June 15, 2019 by Blackbird
lilyoyo1 Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 There is no reading between lines. You just have to read his replies. He stated specifically in his first line; Polisy will replace ISY994 but ISY994 will remain an active and supported product for a variety of business reasons. Adding that it already has what it needs for insteon and they are researching zwave alternatives; INSTEON, there's a DB9 jack on the back which will be used to communicate with INSTEON. Given our horrid history with Z-Wave boards (manufacturing, certification, FCC, obsolescence, etc.), we are considering vetting one (max of two) USB dongles that work reliably (700 series). We are researching. As well as what their plans are with elk; In all likelihood ELK will become a Poly with nodes. Your ELK module will of course have the same features as you already have with your ISY's ELK module
Blackbird Posted June 15, 2019 Author Posted June 15, 2019 (edited) Did you read my question? I asked if the current hardware version of the polisy will be capable of replacing the isy. No where did I see a model number for the current version so all he said was Polisy will replace it. I asked a specific question. Maybe a newer hardware version of "polisy" will be required in the future to achieve what was stated. Are you here to moderate this forum? I guess were not all as smart as you are. I will ask the questions I'm curious about and if you dont like the way I ask questions in my own thread then dont read it. Edited June 15, 2019 by Blackbird
lilyoyo1 Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 You're more than welcome to ask what you want. I'm just stating that he gave you an answer. If he was speaking on a future version he would have said so. Instead he stated that it would do exactly what you asked. It's not about intelligence. It's simply you refusing to see what something is.
Michel Kohanim Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 @lilyoyo1, Thank you for the accurate reading of my responses. @Blackbird, The current Polisy models will, at the minimum, be as functional as your existing ISY. The only possible hardware you might need is a Z-Wave thing. At the moment, we are researching whether or not we should use something off the shelf (USB) or painfully make our own again. With kind regards, Michel
Blackbird Posted June 15, 2019 Author Posted June 15, 2019 (edited) 24 minutes ago, Michel Kohanim said: @lilyoyo1, Thank you for the accurate reading of my responses. @Blackbird, The current Polisy models will, at the minimum, be as functional as your existing ISY. The only possible hardware you might need is a Z-Wave thing. At the moment, we are researching whether or not we should use something off the shelf (USB) or painfully make our own again. With kind regards, Michel Until now I did not see you specify the "current polisy models". That's why I asked that specific question. I assumed over the years the isy has been upgraded with newer hardware like zwave and and the hardware capabilities of the early "isy" models were not as robust. I just wanted to be specific if these entry level "polisy" were capable of replacing isy in the future or you were just speaking of "polisy" in general requiring future models of "polisy". Thank you for clearing that up. Edited June 15, 2019 by Blackbird
simplextech Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 25 minutes ago, Michel Kohanim said: At the moment, we are researching whether or not we should use something off the shelf (USB) or painfully make our own again. I think it would be more cost effective and more agile to use an existing USB dongle perhaps an OEM from SiLabs? 1
Blackbird Posted June 15, 2019 Author Posted June 15, 2019 @Michel Kohanim You mentioned the db9 jack will be used to communicate with insteon. Does that mean it connects to the PLM or the PLM wont be needed?
simplextech Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 8 minutes ago, Blackbird said: @Michel Kohanim You mentioned the db9 jack will be used to communicate with insteon. Does that mean it connects to the PLM or the PLM wont be needed? PLM is always needed. The DB9 is the traditional serial port connection that connects to the PLM. Interesting to return to the standard DB9 interface over the RJ45 port. I think I like that. However I question the longevity of the Serial PLM over the USB PLM.... With that question at hand @Michel Kohanim are there backup provisions to use a USB PLM? It would be very nice if the new Polisy could use EITHER the USB or Serial PLM... that would be nice.
Blackbird Posted June 15, 2019 Author Posted June 15, 2019 5 minutes ago, simplextech said: PLM is always needed. The DB9 is the traditional serial port connection that connects to the PLM. Interesting to return to the standard DB9 interface over the RJ45 port. I think I like that. However I question the longevity of the Serial PLM over the USB PLM.... With that question at hand @Michel Kohanim are there backup provisions to use a USB PLM? It would be very nice if the new Polisy could use EITHER the USB or Serial PLM... that would be nice. Thanks
mwester Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 It would be a hardware concern primarily - does the Polisy have a USB port? (One would hope so.) The Insteon USB PLM has a USB-to-serial chip inside, so when you plug it into a Linux (or BSD) system it automagically appears as a serial device - so effectively, if the Polisy has an open USB port, the software change to make it work amounts to telling the UDI software to use a different serial port #.
simplextech Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 5 minutes ago, mwester said: It would be a hardware concern primarily - does the Polisy have a USB port? (One would hope so.) The Insteon USB PLM has a USB-to-serial chip inside, so when you plug it into a Linux (or BSD) system it automagically appears as a serial device - so effectively, if the Polisy has an open USB port, the software change to make it work amounts to telling the UDI software to use a different serial port #. Yes it does have at least one USB port as Michel has referenced the use of a USB dongle for Z-Wave options. This same USB option leaves it open to use for ZigBee options as well??? So the larger question is... How MANY USB ports does this box have and how closely spaced are they so as to allow multiple dongles without using extension cables.
lilyoyo1 Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 1 hour ago, Blackbird said: Until now I did not see you specify the "current polisy models". That's why I asked that specific question. I assumed over the years the isy has been upgraded with newer hardware like zwave and and the hardware capabilities of the early "isy" models were not as robust. I just wanted to be specific if these entry level "polisy" were capable of replacing isy or you were just speaking of polisy in general. Thank you for clearing that up. That's one of the many reasons why I'm such an ardent supporter of the ISY. They don't change stuff simply to change them. When they come out with new hardware its because new hardware is needed. The isy I received in 2012/2013 can use the same modules and boards that an isy994 produced today can use. They are great at forward thinking and ensuring their products can last for years without forcing customers to upgrade every couple. 4
larryllix Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 (edited) Yes it does have at least one USB port as Michel has referenced the use of a USB dongle for Z-Wave options. This same USB option leaves it open to use for ZigBee options as well??? So the larger question is... How MANY USB ports does this box have and how closely spaced are they so as to allow multiple dongles without using extension cables. Looks like four. 2 internal and two external https://corpshadow.biz/pcengines/apu3b2-system-board Edited June 15, 2019 by larryllix
jfai Posted June 16, 2019 Posted June 16, 2019 @Michel Kohanim What's the power consumption of the two Polisy systems? What are the operating temperature requirements?
giesen Posted June 17, 2019 Posted June 17, 2019 Please, please use an external Z-Wave USB stick (perhaps something like the Aeon Labs Z-stick). That way the network can be set up without dragging the Polisy all over the house on an extension cord. It also means I can use a USB cable to position the stick outside of the can my ISY is mounted in (which is why I have not upgraded to the newer z-wave module - no external antenna support) Sent from my SM-N9500 using Tapatalk
Michel Kohanim Posted June 17, 2019 Posted June 17, 2019 @larryllix, Just so that we can stave off confusion (I hope), although Polisy is based on PC Engines APU2, but it's not identical as we have our own BIOS chipset with TPM + additional interfaces. In short, ISY specific code will NOT run on PC Engines. @jfailenschmid, 12V @ max 2A (when you have peripherals). But, normally 12V @1A = 12W. Temperature range is commercial. @giesen, That's what we are leaning towards as well. With kind regards, Michel 1
asbril Posted June 17, 2019 Posted June 17, 2019 5 hours ago, giesen said: Please, please use an external Z-Wave USB stick (perhaps something like the Aeon Labs Z-stick). That way the network can be set up without dragging the Polisy all over the house on an extension cord. It also means I can use a USB cable to position the stick outside of the can my ISY is mounted in (which is why I have not upgraded to the newer z-wave module - no external antenna support) Sent from my SM-N9500 using Tapatalk FYI I use a Google Wifi mesh router and if I need to move the ISY closer to a new Zwave device, for initial installation, I just connect the ISY to a closer Google Wifi pod.
Bumbershoot Posted June 17, 2019 Posted June 17, 2019 8 hours ago, giesen said: That way the network can be set up without dragging the Polisy all over the house on an extension cord. I don't think that needs to be done with new Z-Wave + (Gen5 or 500 series) boards, which have plug and play network wide inclusion. With the 500 series dongle, I was able to include a Schlage lock securely while in place, probably 60 feet from the ISY (I believe this requires Z-Wave + devices along with the board, though I'm not entirely certain about that). UDI indicated that they're exploring using the newer 700 series Z-Wave in the Polisy. If this works correctly, you'll be able to simply install the device and power it on for inclusion.
lilyoyo1 Posted June 17, 2019 Posted June 17, 2019 30 minutes ago, Bumbershoot said: I don't think that needs to be done with new Z-Wave + (Gen5 or 500 series) boards, which have plug and play network wide inclusion. With the 500 series dongle, I was able to include a Schlage lock securely while in place, probably 60 feet from the ISY (I believe this requires Z-Wave + devices along with the board, though I'm not entirely certain about that). UDI indicated that they're exploring using the newer 700 series Z-Wave in the Polisy. If this works correctly, you'll be able to simply install the device and power it on for inclusion. For NWI, all devices already installed need to support it otherwise NWI would not work (All devices must be plus as you mentioned). I'M surprised your lock worked since NWI is only for hardwired devices.
Bumbershoot Posted June 17, 2019 Posted June 17, 2019 1 minute ago, lilyoyo1 said: For NWI, all devices already installed need to support it otherwise NWI would not work (All devices must be plus as you mentioned). I'M surprised your lock worked since NWI is only for hardwired devices. I didn't expect it to work either, but I tried it after I upgraded to the 500 series dongle and it worked. Needless to say, I was pleased. I'm curious, do all Z-Wave devices on the network need to be plus for this to work, or just all the devices along the route to the ISY?
simplextech Posted June 17, 2019 Posted June 17, 2019 2 hours ago, Bumbershoot said: I'm curious, do all Z-Wave devices on the network need to be plus for this to work, or just all the devices along the route to the ISY? All within the give route/path must be ZWP. NWI is a feature of ZWP. So be aware that if you have none ZWP devices if the route changes (and they do) to a particular device or group of devices then NWI may not work sometimes when it did work before. 1
Blackbird Posted June 18, 2019 Author Posted June 18, 2019 @Michel Kohanim When the polisy is capable of replacing the isy, will there be a difference in the limit of devices and programs between the non pro and pro? Will the limits be more than the current isy pro? Thanks
Michel Kohanim Posted June 19, 2019 Posted June 19, 2019 @Blackbird, No. But, this does not mean that we will not have Polisy Pro XYZ that supports 3000 nodes. With kind regards, Michel 1
Recommended Posts