I think I am going to add an EISY program that turns off, waits 60s, turns back on - my cable modem - maybe run it twice a week. I have a remote house that is not impossible to drive to but would take a good chunk out of the day round trip. This past week, my EISY at that residence was being reported as Offline by UD-Mobile, and apparently it was as I was not able to access it over my VPN. But, I can't tell if it's the cable modem or the Synology router that is flaking out - I believe it's the cable modem. The cable modem has no interface to access or test or even ping. I assume that turning off the cable modem (with an on/off device) would not cause any grief to my EISY device and it will continue to run just fine on the local LAN for the approx 2 minutes when the cable modem is not available. My hope, is that if it is in fact the cable modem that flakes out then I can avoid a week+ time period with no remote/vpn access. I assume I could also do the same for the Synology router but that has a reboot schedule built-in (and I hope that the reboot is for the entire mesh).

Not sure how long it would take UD Mobile to find that it cannot connect to this EISY.

Wondering if anyone has had to do something like this?

There's a few moving parts here and it's probably best to go through them.

(Good brand) Cable modems are not problematic. My arris s33 cable modem about to go into to its 5th year and I've never had to reboot it. If I lose internet, lights on the front tell me that Xfinity is not communicating with the modem, not the modem

What brand router do you have? That can be another weak link. In my experience, you get what you pay for with routers.

Another complexity is running a VPN. If you have the UDI portal, you can access the eisy without a vpn and without opening ports in your router. Based on what's written, I'm most suspicious of the VPN. How is the VPN endpoint set up in the remote house, what is hosting it?

Just now, paulbates said:

There's a few moving parts here and it's probably best to go through them.

(Good brand) Cable modems are not problematic. My arris s33 cable modem about to go into to its 5th year and I've never had to reboot it. If I lose internet, lights on the front tell me that Xfinity is not communicating with the modem, not the modem

What brand router do you have? That can be another weak link. In my experience, you get what you pay for with routers.

Another complexity is running a VPN. If you have the UDI portal, you can access the eisy without a vpn and without opening ports in your router. Based on what's written, I'm most suspicious of the VPN. How is the VPN endpoint set up in the remote house, what is hosting it?

The router is Synology (full mesh with 3 nodes in the house#2). I consider Synology brand (both routers and NAS) as A++. The VPN is run by Synology's "Site-to-Site VPN" built-in which is using IPSec - both sides are using the same Synology devices and the same VPN config - the VPN is good. The VPN is not the problem - given that UD Mobile cannot access my EISY (at house#2) and pops up a notification that it cannot. If I lost just the VPN then UD Mobile would still see that EISY (at house#2) through UD Portal. I do not use the VPN for UD, I use it for the remote cameras to write back to the NAS nvr in house#1. I do not have any modem lights to look at on the modem - I'm not there to see them. But even if I were, I do not feel that is any guarantee since house#1's fiber modem, the LEDs are not accurate since I've had to reboot that thing about 1 to 2 times a year when all "looks" okay. Interestingly, I am going to swap out Cablevision's modem with my old Arris Surboard (that I used in house#1 before upgrading to fiber). (Fiber is not available at house#2 and wouldn't pay for it even if it were.) I don't recall having to reboot the Arris Surfboard but I had that modem for about 5 years maybe but maybe I did. My main reason for "bringing my own equipment" is to knock down the monthly fee and that the Arris SB is just collecting dust right now.

Interesting though that my Honeywell thermostat reported no outage but I suspect it uses very minimal "heart-beat" (not sure if it keeps an open TCP connection). I could at very rare times access a camera or 2. I suspect that the modem, for whatever reason, had downgraded me to a trickle (and not for using excessive bandwidth).

I should add that when I arrived at house#2 I just restarted everything at house#2. Router lights were all good at least. I could have messed around and did some diagnosis but I wasn't there with a computer. Restarting both modem and router(s) UD Mobile was back online with that house's EISY.

IN my former location I was using ASUS routers in a three unit mesh. They had problems. However a lot of deices have problems with mesh setup also. Many devices will not tolerate changing APs if the are mobile devices and move. Many devices will not tolerate the quickie testing routers can do to change bands.

I wrote some ISY programmes to test if things were not responding and use progressive power cycling of the routers (increasing in cycle length times) and that seemed to fix most of it.

Then I got another WiFi device with remote control that I could power cycle the ISY from another country if needed. Now, I had both ends covered after a few vacations were everything was dead for two weeks and I was helpless to fix it.

Since moving, I have an ISP combo modem and, like the others, it doesn't like the frequent power blinks the utility does here. It seems ISY and polisy now tries to get an IP address from the router DHCP server and when it can't, it just gives up and disconnects. Poor design.

The fix, this time, was to get a fridge low voltage detector for polisy and when the power blinks it delays power up on my polisy for five minutes. I haven't seen that problem now for about a month since install. This allows the router to come up to speed, before polisy even tries to request an IP address.
They sell on amazon for about $15 so well worth the price.

40 minutes ago, larryllix said:

IN my former location I was using ASUS routers in a three unit mesh. They had problems. However a lot of deices have problems with mesh setup also. Many devices will not tolerate changing APs if the are mobile devices and move. Many devices will not tolerate the quickie testing routers can do to change bands.

I wrote some ISY programmes to test if things were not responding and use progressive power cycling of the routers (increasing in cycle length times) and that seemed to fix most of it.

Then I got another WiFi device with remote control that I could power cycle the ISY from another country if needed. Now, I had both ends covered after a few vacations were everything was dead for two weeks and I was helpless to fix it.

Since moving, I have an ISP combo modem and, like the others, it doesn't like the frequent power blinks the utility does here. It seems ISY and polisy now tries to get an IP address from the router DHCP server and when it can't, it just gives up and disconnects. Poor design.

The fix, this time, was to get a fridge low voltage detector for polisy and when the power blinks it delays power up on my polisy for five minutes. I haven't seen that problem now for about a month since install. This allows the router to come up to speed, before polisy even tries to request an IP address.
They sell on amazon for about $15 so well worth the price.

I would love to see a sample of that program that test if things are responding. What Wifi device are you referring to exactly? I'm not following, if your home network is shot how can you communicate with this wifi device?

You could always do it the low tech way. The hardware store has some plug in digital timers that will turn things on and off based on how it's programmed.

To check your modem's uptime, could you use a site like Uptime Robot to monitor your endpoint? I know they have a free tier for running small tests like this.

Some modems have internal diagnostics accessible online. Cable modems record Downstream Power, Signal to Noise Ratio, and Upstream Power. A high upstream power value is usually the cause of many intermittent failures. Your service provider can provide you with information on the acceptable ranges for each metric recorded.

1 minute ago, matapan said:

Your service provider can provide you with information on the acceptable ranges for each metric recorded.

I don't know what service provider you use. I can't even get a simple answer to a question about my bill. Even if they had such info they would never get it. The only is if one of their techs is in your house but even then some of them are first day on the job.

I had a problem a long time ago with my modem. My service provider is Comcast. Here is what the technician disclosed during our exchange:

Downstream Power:

• ideal: -7 dBmV to +7 dBmV

• marginal: +/-10

• bad: > +/- 12

Signal to Noise Ratio:

good: > 35 dB

marginal: 30-34 dB

bad: < 30 dB

Upstream Power:

ideal: 35-50 dBmV

marginal: > 52 dBmV

bad: > 54 dBmV

I also have two homes and inevitably the "remote" one will go offline. But I was hesitant to have the eISY handle the router reboot since it has to talk to the router. My solution is just a plain old digital timer on my router. Mine are scheduled to reboot once a week in the early Sunday AM.

My current "remote" house went offline a few days ago. I am patiently waiting for Sunday to roll around.

Edited yesterday at 11:12 AM1 day by jkmcfadden

I have a program that turns off my router for 1 minute and then turns it back on. [Edit based on @dbwarner5's question below: As @larryllix says below, my router and cable modem is plugged into an Insteon On/Off module that is controlled by my ISY. No wifi needed].

I have Kasa wifi plugs for my ISY and Polisy that allows me to turn those on/off manually (as long as the router is on, of course). YoLink also has similar wifi plugs.

Ross

Edited 50 minutes ago50 min by Ross

43 minutes ago, Ross said:

I have a program that turns off my router for 1 minute and then turns it back on.

I have Kasa wifi plugs for my ISY and Polisy that allows me to turn those on/off manually (as long as the router is on, of course). YoLink also has similar wifi plugs.

Ross

What do you use to turn your router off for 1 minute?

2 hours ago, dbwarner5 said:

What do you use to turn your router off for 1 minute?

ISY and Insteon OnOff modules. Totally on it's own network, no WiFi, no LAN, only power required.

13 hours ago, raymondjiii said:

I would love to see a sample of that program that test if things are responding. What Wifi device are you referring to exactly? I'm not following, if your home network is shot how can you communicate with this wifi device?

If WiFi or Remote devices do not respond correctly then something Internet or LAN is not functioning. Insteon can now cycle the power to your router(s).
Sending an on and off signal via ISY Portal to Alexa routine and back to an ISY variable or program tests a lot of comunications out and back.

If your polisy/ISY/eISY does not respond from a remote location, another brand of WiFi controlled power plug can power cycle them (HA controller) via remote app of that brand.

IOW:
ISY with Insteon monitors your WiFi equipment via Insteon devices.
Remote WiFi control devices can manually toggle the power to ISY via WiFi / LAN by human intervention.

Edited 18 hours ago18 hr by larryllix

20 hours ago, raymondjiii said:

I think I am going to add an EISY program that turns off, waits 60s, turns back on - my cable modem - maybe run it twice a week.

This would be simple if you had an on/off outlet for the modem. I might wait a little longer than 60 seconds for the modem to be fully offline and the cable provider to "know" the device was offline. Make sure the program isn't set to run at startup in case you have a power outage and it shuts things down just as things are trying to boot up.

I would probably go the route that @Ross did and get an inexpensive "smart plug" and just have an automation within that app to turn the plug off for 3-5 minutes (maybe middle of the night). It's tricky though do those power back on if the network is down when the scheduled time to turn back on happens? I don't use them so can't test (haven't tested).

But ultimately, it comes down to what are you really fixing? You might still have underlying internet issues somewhere that would be better fixed with the provider. You're just making a work around situation rather than getting them to fix their problems (or finding out that it's something on your side that needs fixing).

It's kind of like when router manufacturers added the ability to self reboot on a schedule. Why did they do this? Because they wrote bad code that would cause the router to lock up over time and people felt it was easier to make a reboot schedule than to buy a better quality router. You're just rebooting a problem rather than having the cable provider "fix" or at the very least troubleshoot if they have potential issues.

3 hours ago, Geddy said:

It's kind of like when router manufacturers added the ability to self reboot on a schedule. Why did they do this? Because they wrote bad code that would cause the router to lock up over time and people felt it was easier to make a reboot schedule than to buy a better quality router. You're just rebooting a problem rather than having the cable provider "fix" or at the very least troubleshoot if they have potential issues.

I do not agree with your assessment of having a reboot schedule implies "bad code" - at all. An operating system has memory fragmentation, caching issues. In addition, having a "scheduled reboot" allows for the OS to cleanup. A "scheduled reboot" is not the same as pulling the plug out of the wall.

The cable company WILL NEVER have someone come out and do all of these things that you are claiming. I do not have 10+ hours in a row to fight with multiple people as I get thrown around to different people that really have no clue. I'm glad that at least someone has a good cable provider.

4 hours ago, larryllix said:

IOW:
ISY with Insteon monitors your WiFi equipment via Insteon devices.
Remote WiFi control devices can manually toggle the power to ISY via WiFi / LAN by human intervention.

But what WiFi / LAN is this remote device using? If it's in my house it's using the only Wifi and LAN that are there. I'm not following how a separate wifi device will accomplish the same as your description of ISY with Insteon which is basically what I'm going to do.

4 hours ago, larryllix said:

ISY and Insteon OnOff modules. Totally on it's own network, no WiFi, no LAN, only power required.

I'm wondering if an EISY would boot - if it cannot DHCP it's IP address - hopefully it skips that step but I wonder what else is dependent internally on such a connection.

Come to think of it...I think there have been cases when the service went out and I had to restart my EISY. The only reason I know is because of UD Mobile.

Edited 16 hours ago16 hr by raymondjiii

7 hours ago, Ross said:

I have a program that turns off my router for 1 minute and then turns it back on.

I have Kasa wifi plugs for my ISY and Polisy that allows me to turn those on/off manually (as long as the router is on, of course). YoLink also has similar wifi plugs.

Ross

Right, but my problem was that the network is shot so I don't think this will help when the network goes south.

But something like a positive ACK failing to come back to the EISY could indicate the network is not in a good state and trigger the Insteon On/Off module - even stagger the modem and router. Can this even be done though on an EISY - make a simple network connection? My EISY program experience is limited.

16 hours ago, matapan said:

I had a problem a long time ago with my modem. My service provider is Comcast. Here is what the technician disclosed during our exchange:

Downstream Power:

• ideal: -7 dBmV to +7 dBmV

• marginal: +/-10

• bad: > +/- 12

Signal to Noise Ratio:

good: > 35 dB

marginal: 30-34 dB

bad: < 30 dB

Upstream Power:

ideal: 35-50 dBmV

marginal: > 52 dBmV

bad: > 54 dBmV

I've done some speed-tests in the past using a cable splitter (with and without the splitter). Cablevision basically tells you to take the -3.5db (or even the -7db) output from your splitter and not to direct connect the service to the modem. I've had that in the past but in this case I'm not using a splitter yet. It would be nice if these cable service provider modems could allow the end user to look at things. I thought that was part of the whole docsys 3.1 thing. With the fiber modem they purposely disable the "advanced settings" on the portal. I have no idea even what those settings are because you cannot even see them.

12 hours ago, jkmcfadden said:

I also have two homes and inevitably the "remote" one will go offline. But I was hesitant to have the eISY handle the router reboot since it has to talk to the router. My solution is just a plain old digital timer on my router. Mine are scheduled to reboot once a week in the early Sunday AM.

My current "remote" house went offline a few days ago. I am patiently waiting for Sunday to roll around.

I am going to have the EISY just handle the modem restart. I'm going to let the build in router reboot schedule do it's thing. No way to prove it but I'd bet $5000 that my problem was the modem and weather played a part.

Yep, I know the feeling - that's exactly what I was doing....waiting for Sunday to roll around.

4 hours ago, raymondjiii said:

I do not agree with your assessment of having a reboot schedule implies "bad code" - at all. An operating system has memory fragmentation, caching issues. In addition, having a "scheduled reboot" allows for the OS to cleanup. A "scheduled reboot" is not the same as pulling the plug out of the wall.

The cable company WILL NEVER have someone come out and do all of these things that you are claiming. I do not have 10+ hours in a row to fight with multiple people as I get thrown around to different people that really have no clue. I'm glad that at least someone has a good cable provider.

But what WiFi / LAN is this remote device using? If it's in my house it's using the only Wifi and LAN that are there. I'm not following how a separate wifi device will accomplish the same as your description of ISY with Insteon which is basically what I'm going to do.

They are not the same devices and both operate from different sources.

ISY and Insteon power cycle your router.
Remote WiFi via Internet power cycle your ISY manually by yourself from an app that comes with that brand of smart receptacle.

Waiting for up to a week may leave you on vacation for a week without any monitoring, reporting and home blind.
If your grid power blinks and ISY doesn't reconnect it may eave you home blind until you reboot your ISY with a fresh router.

If you have any PG3x devices most have a heartbeat that makes it easy to detect if things are all working properly.

Eg. ecobee thermostats with the jimbo NS can detect a cloud connection both ways as well as your router function is intact.

10 hours ago, larryllix said:

They are not the same devices and both operate from different sources.

ISY and Insteon power cycle your router.
Remote WiFi via Internet power cycle your ISY manually by yourself from an app that comes with that brand of smart receptacle.

Waiting for up to a week may leave you on vacation for a week without any monitoring, reporting and home blind.
If your grid power blinks and ISY doesn't reconnect it may eave you home blind until you reboot your ISY with a fresh router.

If you have any PG3x devices most have a heartbeat that makes it easy to detect if things are all working properly.

Eg. ecobee thermostats with the jimbo NS can detect a cloud connection both ways as well as your router function is intact.

I'm trying to understand this remote Wifi device. If it's in your house and you have no Internet "network" then how is this device connecting to? I don't care if the device connects back to "its cloud" somewhere (like Feit brand cameras do and you access the cameras at the cloud address) - if it's like that - how does "the cloud" signal make it back into your house where there is no network at all. If it's not running on a cell network I fail to see how this device is going to connect back to its app. Or rather, how "the app" is going to connect it "it". The Feit camera might be connected to "the cloud" and you access it via it's cloud IP address - but the network stream is still going from your house network to said cloud. No home network - nothing is phoning home back to the clould

@raymondjiii

When I am home, my ISY reboots the router for 1 minute at 5:15pm each day. If my network happens to be down or on the fritz, 99% of the time it comes back up.

When I'm on vacation, the ISY reboots the router twice per day. Therefore, I never have more than 12 hours of home-blindness (I like that term @larryllix).

As long as the network is up, I can then use a manual app (Kasa or Yolink with their respective smart plugs) to reboot my ISY and/or Polisy if I feel it's necessary to do so. Both have plug-ins; so, you could program them to also reboot if you choose. I prefer the manual method.

I hope this is responsive to your questions.

Ross

16 hours ago, raymondjiii said:

but I'd bet $5000 that my problem was the modem and weather played a part.

I had this kind of problem in the distant past, it was an old cable drop from the pole/service to the house. The service got flaky sometimes when it was raining. The service provider at the time replaced it and that resolved it. I remember I walked around with him as he checked it out. He remved the connection from the drop to the house... shook it and water came out!