lilyoyo1

When it comes to wiring a house, I still wire it as a dummy home then add automation on top of it. Since automation is built on existing infrastructure, I know however things turn out down the road, devices will always work. I've found this is especially important since homes are constantly sold and not everyone wants automation. It allows you to put standard switches in and move on. For me, there are no time saving methods at startup. This is when I put the most work in to save time later on. When I set up an ISY, I only use the pro version. This allows me to turn off linking until all devices are ready. I add my devices to the isy prior to installation. This allows me to factory reset each one, and verify that devices work. This way, if something goes wrong, I know I'm not troubleshooting a dead device. I label the devices for my electrician and add it to the rooms it's supposed to be in in the ISY. I then make a backup of my system. This allows me to "reset" the system down the road without starting completely over. After all that I create my scenes. Creating 3ways, adding devices to Keypads etc. while they are being installed. I can even work on programming should I choose. I don't use all standard switches. Each room gets a keypad so that I can control multiple things from a single location. The only switches Ina room are for that room itself. The kpl has my scenes for that room. This allows me to set the mood when I walk in vs. having to use the individual switches. I can also control other locations should I choose. Since keypad buttons can be labeled, it lets guests know exactly what's what vs trying to figure out what a switch goes to

I don't think the post should be deleted as it's educational for those looking to learn something. Varying thoughts and debates are a good thing as it gives more than 1 perspective regardless of right/wrong/indifference. There are merits to both sides and having debates such as this allows others to learn the why's and how to work around to certain problems. As you said, someone may not be tech savvy. The benefits to one is a detriment to another. Since UDI can't please everyone, I think they pick a happy medium by giving a person a way to query a device without bogging down the system unneccessarily.

It's possible. Delete it and re-add the device

To be honest, I'm happy for 5 years out of any of these companies. I understand the whys of inovelli, just pointing out that anything can fail. I have a keypad in certain rooms that's there for status and control of devices outside of the room that does what your sentinel lights do. The only difference is mine tells me what I'm looking at and I can take action right then if I choose. No one has to remember what a certain dot stands for (Though I do wish insteon would make the back lights color changing). Whole not color changing, it is a place where insteon isn't playing catch up Does your fan location have 2 switches or 1? Do you actually change the speeds often

Truthfully, I don't care about the underlying company. My whole house is done. At this point I replace devices simply to keep up with how stuff works, compatibility, and what they can do. For me, a switch is a switch. They turn on, off, and dim. Should insteon or any company go out of business my stuff will still work. The magic isn't in the switch itself. It's in the programming and how it fits your life. This is why I chose insteon for actual lights. I live that everything is in sync not 1 device at a time. In ways it's amazing when it happens. Especially when you consider how zwave works. Should I need to replace all of my devices, (which will happen in the next few years) I will look at what available and choose what's best at that time. If it's insteon then so be it. If they aren't around, I'd probably go with Control4. I truly believe in choosing the best technology period for what you're willing and able to spend. Regardless of company... Any can go out of business. If your whole house is ge and they stopped making stuff what are you going to do? But something else. No difference at all

I'll tell you what. If you don't respond to posts I won't respond to yours. However, since I don't mind disagreements (I feel they are learning experiences and open to free expression) feel free to post rebuttals to my posts anytime. I don't get offended by passive aggresibe childish name calling. See was that so bad?

My blood pressure is right where it's supposed to be. Thanks for your concern. These forums are for open debates. I don't call you names, abuse you, berate you, etc. I've actually agreed with you from time to time and given you credit when credit is due. I don't need to put you on ignore. If you don't like people calling you out or open debates without being offended then it's a simple fix.....don't post. You want to come on here, RESPOND and say your peace but can't handle it when someone responds back. That's your issue not mine.

There are fans and then there are haters. Insteon doesn't work for everyone and you are one it didn't work for. There are many that zwave doesn't work for. Doesn't make it a bad system. By the way. The inlinelinc has not been discontinued. https://www.smarthome.com/in-linelinc-relay-insteon-2475sdb-remote-control-in-line-on-off-switch-dual-band.html You're funny, insteon disco's a few non selling devices and you act like everything is gone, yet whole zwave companies have folded yet say nothing about that.

All systems need some type of card. For insteon it's the plm and zwave it's the dongle. I do like your analogy but when I look at your posts over the years, while you've kept the same car, you constantly had to buy new parts to keep it running. Just in your inovelli products alone, you've spent more on that than on a new plm. To each their own. At the end of the day as long as we're happy with our choices it's all a moot point

A bunch of half baked products that barely work well. What you say is closer to being a fanboy than me. I'd rather use hue or lifx which offer 10x better experience than zwave counterparts. Give me an ecobee or nest thermostat over a zwave thermostat anything. I'd love to use glas if they had an API but since they don't I leave them out. End the end, a fan boy is one who will use a product no matter what. Hmmm sounds like someone should look in the mirror. Zwave has improved over the years yet they are still playing catch up when it comes to making a high quality system. They've made great strides in some places but not in those that matter in regards to passing the eye test I'll be more willing to use them for lights when they get to the point where 2 different lights will turn off at the same time or me not needing a manual just to make a simple change....if it can be done at all.

Quit with the fan boy shit. I use both insteon and zwave (amongst others). Most likely I have much more invested in zwave devices than you do yet I'm the fan boy. The fact is, the way insteon operates is simply better than zwave. If you're ok with your lights turning on 1 at a time instead of in sync it's ok. If you're ok with needing to find a manual any time you want to change ramp rates etc. That's your business..I like insteon over zwave because I can do more with it. That's not being a fan boy. That's enjoying something that works to my liking. I go for the best technology for my needs not technology for the sake of technology (or to say I have other inferior choices). At this junction zwave is still inferior. Should that ever change I will switch. Until then I'll use insteon (unless I can talk my wife into Control4)

It really doesnt matter at the end of the day. We all have the ISY. Whether you like insteon, Zwave, or something else, the ISY allows us to use them all together. Where insteon lacks there may be a Zwave alternative. Where Zwave lacks, there may be an insteon alternative or something else. It all comes down to what floats your boat.

You mean like everyone else who makes zwave devices? There is only 1 in wall motion sensor and thats by GE

What did you put as your spoken

How is it currently setup? What steps did you take? Alexa and google home can control the load button as it is seen as a switch. Only the secondary buttons would need to be part of something to get it controlled.

I can agree with your last point. At the end of the day a light switch turns stuff on, off, or dim. The controller is what makes things great. I'd rather have a full function controller that allows for great things with the best of all worlds than a bunch of half baked products trying to do a bunch of stuff halfway. What you get wrong is that I'm not an insteon fanboy. If that were the case, I wouldn't have any zwave products nor a willingness to try them. I can speak on the differences because I use both and I've tried both. I just haven't found a single zwave switch that's surpasses insteon in ease of use and operation. Fanboys buy product from 1 vendor just because it's that vendor. I buy products that integrated with the controller that I use and gives me the best experience possible. That's insteon for lights, zwave for sensors and locks, hue for accent lights (color changing), ecobee for HVAC, and rain machine for irrigation. This includes using a multitude of different controllers such as homeseer, smartthings, and fibaro. The way zwave operates is a non starter for me. Their quality and design have improved with some mfg. (Aeotec glass switch) but until they do something about that popcorn effect, it's a hell no for me. I'd be more concerned about security if I had someone turning my lights on/off but I'm not. Until then I can live with someone possibly knowing a device address. The same goes for zwave. Unless either zwave or insteon can stop someone from breaking my windows or kicking in my door, Imma be ok. I'd rather watch my lights dim down, turn off in unison rather than the funky popcorn effect

It trips me out how upgradeable firmware is the go to zwave feature that differentiates them from insteon. Yet none of the oems are taking advantage of that for the most part. Some like aeotech and fibaro have used it to fix critical use bugs (which means they never should have been released) but none have used them to add new features. Take ge for example. They have a full line of zwave plus devices which can be upgraded with the new security features. Yet instead of doing so, they've started releasing newer versions of the same switch instead. A feature is only good if it's put to use. Most companies dont

Have you seen what iron automation would cost. People complain about paying 50 bucks for a switch. Do you really think they would pay whatnot would cost to have that detailed of a home. No dimmer is rated for fans. They could create a switch but went the fanlinc route instead which I would prefer when compared to zwave offerings. Colored lights would be great. However, I wouldn't want a system that's inferior to what I use now. I've tried finaro's rgbw controller as well as aeotec bulbs. Both are sitting in a box somewhere unused. I would still take hue or lifx over both as they are light years ahead of either one. They can release a new thermostat. Would it be better than the ecobee 3s that I currently use? Probably not. Would it be better than what I would love to replace mine with (glas if they ever release an API). Definitely not. My thermostats were installed for style as much as they were for function. When I look at zwave offerings there's no way I would touch one of those either. We all are different so I'm not knocking you for sharing to see certain things. Since I have a system that can use multiple things, my ideals have changed. I no longer want to use any company for the sake of saying I have something. I go with the best thing available that works with the isy. Insteon or any company can create something just to say they have something. Reality is, there will probably be things better made. Since we are using the isy, the best available takes on a truer meaning. With that said, it's easy to innovate when you're playing catch up. In terms of ease of use, features, capabilities etc. you won't find zwave in the same ball park. Just like with smartphones, devices are simply getting to the point where you can't really innovate unless you're coming from nothing.

Over the last few years they've been working on improving quality inn their existing lined. Albeit these are changes you won't see but changes none the less. Now that I've answered your question, how about answering mine. What is it that you're seeing zwave switches do that insteon switches can't?

What's stagnant about them? What are you trying to do with your switches that you can do with zwave but not insteon?

It will be quite some time before Polisy can replace your ISY and the admin console that is currently required. In the beginning nothing changes from what is done currently as Polisy is an add on device. From what I gather, the ISY is accessed once you are able to port your system to polisy would be done the same way

I'm not speaking out of loyalty but experience. As someone who has done over 100 installs, used multiple systems over the years etc. I've researched and learned what works and how. Even now I'm still learning. Simply dismissing what a person says because you think they are a fan can prevent you from learning about how things work. Go ahead and purchase a smartthings hub and see what happens when you do the same. Hell set up a query to check all your devices and then try to use a device during that time. You'll see then why it doesn't constantly query. Now imagine a large install. Is the isy perfect....no. however no system is. It's pros far outweighs it's cons. When I look at how the isy works, UDI's responsiveness etc. I see a great system. With that said, they can't fix stuff that isn't inherent in a device. In regards to elk, I personally use one myself. While my alarm was unarmed, I disconnected a sensor and lo and behold. No alert. When I tried to arm the sensor I received an alert. This is why I made the statement I did. Your system may not be reliable but mine and many others are. Thats why we continue to invest in them.

For starters, the isy (and other controllers) and zwave devices aren't alarm systems. Both serve different functions and respond/behave as such. Even then should you remove a sensor from an alarm sensor, it will not alert you unless you A) run a test or arm the system. For some systems, periodically it will ping a device (once per 24 hrs). Since you mentioned Elk. Go ahead and test this for yourself. You'll be shocked to learn the truth. Try it with any alarm system Automation works differently. If a person has many devices periodic checks can bog down your system. For example, I have over 130 devices in my isy. If the isy were to run periodic checks, how long do you think it would take? What if I'm trying to control something during that time? The delay for something to happen wouldn't be worth it. You can write a program to query devices at regular times of it's that important. However a generic query all will hurt more than it helps. This is why the 3am query happens at that time. Less chance of interference BTW- this is a protocol limitation. Both insteon and zwave devices have the same limitation. Before complaining and blaming someone else, you should at least get to know HOW your products work.

It would be easier for people to help if you said what your device was. For some strange reason you danced around this I'm your whole post

This isn't an isy issue it's how you used your system issue. Its akin to me removing your car battery without telling you. In your mind it's still there until you go to start your car and find out that it's not