lilyoyo1

The difference between you and I, is that I defend with information you don't have while you sit around and think of the wildest things you can come up with. I'll make a deal- I'll stop when you stop

This is what generally happens. They get caught up initially but after showing off a few times, they never see color again

Hmm....most have installed cheap ir or voice controlled lighting......sound sexactly like what I've been describing as the avg user. Cheap and easy. Not someone willing to invest alot of time and effort in learning and programming an ISY to do what you or most on here do. Thank you.

You've been saying what insteon NEEDS to be doing for 10 years in order to survive and yet here they are. Maybe in 5 years they will be gone. If not what are you going to say then? 5 more years!!!??? At some point you may be right but until then stop with the broken record. Not many people care to support specialty markets. There are plenty of companies doing just fine not doing so. Hell, as many zwave device mfg. are out there, how many have color changing bulbs and other specialty products? The fact is, having core products that sell well is what matters. Making stuff to sit on a shelf for a year and stuff have to keep up with it is foolishness. Say what you want, they're still in business making much more money than we all have

You are also not the typical person. Most techies and hobbyists will do much more than the avg person. Think about those you surround yourself with. How many say your house is cool but they don't need all that? For those who want it, how many of them do you think are really willing to put in as much time as you did to make it happen (outside of extremely like minded people? It's not always about the money but the time it takes to achieve what you have done. Most do not want to invest that

When it comes down to colored lighting, the questions isn't whether people are buying it but rather, how are they using it. In regards to the how, it's not necessary for insteon to compete by making their own bulbs when they simply need to work with the market. What's growing is connecting your products to Google and Alexa. If they don't do that then they fail (which they do). People don't care about the underlying product. They care whether it works with Alexa

Not necessarily...the way the market is now, there are multiple ways to skin a cat. Color has a place but for most, once the novelty wears off, they don't get used much outside of presets. It's easy enough to tell Alexa to turn the lights on blue but after a while how many people actually do that? Most mid to high end homes will use them as accent lights and decorate with them such as what @MrBilldoes with his and I do with underbed lights and plants. But for general lighting, high end homeowners will avoid it overall. Hobbyists on the other hand will continue to tinker and play around with colors and constantly make changes which isn't either of their market.

Nokia still has a recognizable name and that is what this is about. The age group that would buy it still knows the name It's low risk high reward for them.

The thing about Lutron is they aren't really for the hobbyist market. The caseta line is there as an after thought for those who want the Lutron name but not the price of Lutron itself. Sorta like Mercedes. Their focus is on high end luxury cars. They have the A class for those who want the name but do not have the funds for the premium lines. Regardless of how many they sell, they do not put much into making the A class as they do the E and S classes which is their primary focus.

Insteon isn't trying to be lutron. They want to be themselves. They are not looking to be in the market for those who want advanced integrated systems. They are catering to a specific part of the population who doesn't know about the Isy and are not looking for a system such as the Isy. They want to capture new users not chase old. Eventually they may open things to 3rd party systems, but right now while they are trying to start new, it's about them and building their brand. I like the new switches. They do look and feel really good. They aren't nearly as luxurious as Control4/Savant level but at their price point, they look fantastic. Definitely would fit into the decor of a midrange home. I can't say they fit well in a true high end luxury home though. Not when you compare them to other true luxury brands.

All off can be achieved in multiple ways, not just using the all on/off commands

I've talked about the similarities on a few posts. The basic insteon commands are still the same. On/off, dim/brighten. They can be manually added to other insteon devices as a controller or responder and work exactly the same as normal insteon devices. The dial would be dimmable while the paddle would be a relay switch. What you would NOT be able to do is change the modes of the devices. The paddle would not be able to dim and the dial would NOT be able to be used as a relay. They can be added to the Isy but would show up as an unsupported device. You would not be able to change the modules from dimmer to relay (and vice versa). The Isy also would not get status when manually controlled. However, it can turn them on/off and dim (where applicable). The same applies with the new hub. Standard devices can be added to it. However, it will not link them to new devices or receive status. When it comes to the kpl, it adds to the Isy as an unsupported device but only the load shows up. The other buttons do not. The same thing applies when it comes to receiving status and changing modes. You also would not be able to change the primary button In regards to device firmware updates, since those come from insteon servers, only the hub can push updates to the devices themselves. With official support from the Isy, that may be possible but i don't know. Nokia isn't just a smartphone maker. They make network equipment for telecoms, patent licensing and other iot stuff. With that said, this is not a Nokia product line. Smartlabs/insteon is only licensing the name from them. They have nothing to do with the actual product itself except for their technical expertise with some stuff

What high end customers? No serial PLM will be coming anytime soon

I wouldn't accuse a long time member of being a scammer. Scammers typically don't hang around a forum interacting with members long term.

The poster Ed Ventura. Sounds like a scammer

Sounds like someone about to start scamming

This has already been talked about countless times on this thread and many others

Firmware and UI of your isy?

You'd want to do that even with 700 series as zwave doesn't handle multi scenes as well

S2 was designed for perimeter protection devices which is why you'll see Alarm systems widely supporting S2 but other controllers slowly adding it. Since the Isy isn't an alarm system, I can see them not rushing to implement it for that reason alone. For lights- the speed of it (or lack there of) makes S2 a bigger pain than actually using it. By default the Isy does support SO security. If/when support comes for s2, only UDI knows. They have stated the 994 WILL NOT receive an upgrade to the 700 series chip. Polisy will have it so I suspect at that point it will have S2. Due to how zwave works by default, the weakness isn't with installed and configured devices. It's while you're adding a device to your system. This is where S2 comes into play as far as preventing stuff. Sure reading all the details behind it makes it seem like S2 is great but in the field, reality is much different

No bug. In addition to what @MrBillsaid, different insteon devices also have different counts. A lol for example would count for 8 devices just like a dual outlet would be 2.

Unless it's your own personal house that you are selling, nothing should come out of your profit unless you're under charging. The clients should be paying for everything. If your flipping houses then that's a different story. To a certain degree, it will come out of your profit but if you factor that into your material costs from the beginning, that's mitigated as well. For example, when I did standard homes for a local builder, he set aside 10k to include insteon and a couple of other things into every home he built. The customer could add on custom programming during/after the sale should they choose. Because it was part of the plans and build, the sell of the house reflected that without cutting into profit. There's more that goes into it but this is the general gist. By using caseta and insteon as you do, you're actually costing yourself money unknowingly. Time is money. If you're running around manually linking things you've just made less per unit than if you sat at a computer doing everything. The same with insteon. Margin is already thin when it comes to low end consumer devices, so upsell is paramount. We'd install on/off switches and non dimmable bulbs. However the customer could opt for dimmable. In doing so, they'd be paying the switch and bulb cost. Pure profit for minimal effort. Down the road, should they find out the cost of an insteon dimmer, they aren't upset at a huge markup which means they're more likely to refer you to friends as well as continue to use you for more services in the future.

Factory reset the switch and test it. If it does not control other lights, restore it in the Isy and test again. If it controls other lights then it's either part of a scene or program thats causing this to happen

To each their own. Casetas built in device limitations makes it a non starter for me (and other high end installers) as those types of homes typically exceed it's capacity. I also prefer all in one solutions as that means I don't have to worry about new devices not being supported or firmware updates from 1 thing causing an issue with another. RA2 is more than an overpriced Caseta. That's like saying a Maybach is the same as the S600. While close, there are subtle details that makes it a step above. Besides, it doesn't matter. It's a business. It's not your money, it's the clients. You're there to maximize what you make without taking advantage of customers. The markup on Ra2 gives you much greater profit margin than Caseta- unless you're adding a ridiculous markup which only serves to piss off customers and lessen the chance of repeat business and/or referrals. By using Caseta, you're costing yourself money by minimizing what you can earn

High end homes deserve high end systems