lilyoyo1

I don't use those strips/setups that you're using so @MrBillwwould definitely know more about them than i do. All of your questions are why I use the exact same stuff for all of my jobs. Less time figuring out what I need and calculations. Also why I love hue. The work is done for you. By the time you pay for everything you need, figure out how to hide it, etc. you've spent more than what hue costs. When I do strip lighting for customers, everything is generally hardwired to be controlled from a standard dimmer so voltage drop is always a concern. This is what I'm basing my response on. For my house, I simply use hue and programming to accomplish the same thing. Mrbill's info is correct in regards to usage. I differ from him in that i assume worse case scenario for my lights which means everything has an IP rating (unless clearly in a dry area) regardless if protected or not. I also assume lights will be used at full brightness and add a little bit extra to be on the safe side. That way, no matter what, i know I'll never run my equipment at maximum power. Depending on your setup, make sure you are using the correct guage of wire to run to your switch (assuming that's your setup). Cutting your strip in half obviously lowers what you need for power but make sure you're calculating what you need by watts per foot. Your mfg. should be able to provide that information. How many LEDs are on each strip also plays a part in that as well. Higher density LEDs (300 vs 150) need a larger transformer from the start. Since your going with 24v from the start, that part is taken care of. I also wanted to add, depending on setup, if you wanted to use 1 overpowered transformer with multiple strips (still do the calculations), you can use a connecting block to run them all together. That way you won't need multiple transformers

Of course i know how......just not doing it. ?

No. Haven't needed to change a tire in a very long time.

I have some of those too. It may surprise you though

You know I like my toys. Time is money. Had to see if it worked. ? There's play in it but i wouldn't say it's too much for light stuff. It's definitely not made for anything major.

I have one. It's good for your run of the mill around the house stuff like they show in the pictures. I wouldn't use it to mount tvs or anything heavy duty. Just pre drill your holes

Hue today isn't the same hue from 8 years ago. It's improved tremendously. I use the iris (started with the old and now new version) alot for indoor plants/trees (such as Cactus, palm, and corn trees). The glow they cast on the wall behind them makes for a phenomenal look that can't be produced with simple uplighting. Personally the new version is too bright for my needs so I turn it way down but still works wonderfully for it.

Home automation generally refers to the things you're trying to get away from. But it is unique to each individual needs so I get where you're coming from. Some of those things you talk about can be done depending on equipment used (as well as system). For me, automation is an experience. By making lighting more responsive and dynamic, you get more satisfaction than you ever could with simple timer devices. Take bathroom lights. I can put in a basic motion switch which will turn them on and off. I take it a step further by having the lights dim as it gets later in the evening. Early morning, they'll turn on slower to full brightness to help your eyes adjust to start your day. The ramp rate goes up the later it gets as the sun is at full brightness and your more likely moving around fully awake. The same with a timer switch. I could use a simple timer switch for my outdoor lights. However, mine dim down the later it gets. Should someone come to the door or we unlock it to leave, they'll turn on 100%. The same applies to the back yard. Unlocking the back door at night to let the dogs out will set the patio lights to a low level and disable the motion lights so they don't turn on full blast. Once back inside with the doors locked, everything turns off and goes back to normal. There's more such as having the lights turn on automatically to our personal settings should one of us be outside as it gets dark (based on lux not time). Using our thermostats, the ceiling fans turn on/off on their own depending on different factors if a room is occupied. Should a fan be on when the AC kicks in, they'll turn themselves off after a few minutes from helping to circulate the air. When cooking, the AC will turn down the temp a few degrees to account for the heat. With AV equipment integrated into lighting, you gain so much more than controlling something with an app. Our living room tv turns on automatically when someone comes home and shuts off when it's bedtime. Since we fall asleep with the tv on, the bedroom tv will automatically shut down once we're asleep so it doesn't stay on all night. Depending on activity, the theater will set the lights the way we want it. Lights turn on for movies and turn off on their own. Pausing a movie will turn on the lights to a dim level and hallway lights so that a person can go to the bathroom or do whatever. Regardless of room, if someone turns a tv on while music is playing, the music will turn down. If we go outside to hang out with the LR tv on, the tv will turn off on its own eventually. These things and more is what I refer to as an experience and what i need from a system.

I agree with all that you say. While wifi works well, there are many other variables at play that must be taken into account when it comes to network. In addition to that, I know what I'm getting with hue in regards to consistency across the board. If i buy a new strip 6 months or a year from now, it'll perform exactly the same as the others that i have. I don't have to worry about whether they'll be around in 6 months like many of these no name companies who show up and disappear constantly on Amazon. I also like that hue enjoys industry wide support. Not saying magic home isn't supported by some systems, just not the way hue is. I will use lifx in one off situations because they do have the same consistency across their line the way hue does. If I'm building out a system with it, Its hue all the way

I understand your point in troubleshooting a single box but that's not always the case. Looking at these forums alone, one can see the multiple points of failure due to network issues, handshakes, etc. Your example is what I want to avoid. Multiple points of failure. Using the Isy for example, it's easier to pinpoint the problem if something isn't working. If no zwave device works, then the board is problem done for. If it's 1 device, then maybe it's a the device. If the device works, then i can look at my programming. Going back to your same example, if your zwave controller is working properly with your other devices, then you look at the device itself. If that works, now you have to turn to the Isy (just using Isy for continuity). What if it doesn't work from there? Is it an ISY issue or communication issue between the 2 controllers? Again, I'm looking at it from a business perspective vs. my home only. Even if it's my house, I have other things I'd rather do than mess around with my system so the same applies. Even if a simple reboot fixes the issue, that's 2 minutes out of my day i could've done something else

I can understand your sentiments. I'm with @Teken though since im looking at things through an installers point of view rather than a hobbyist or enthusiast. Besides the power savings, setting up multiple controllers means more time needed to install a system, more time troubleshooting, and increases the likelihood of failure or something going wrong. All of which means unhappy people (including the wife at home). As an installer, everything i do is a charge. If I'm quoting a customer, i have to take into consideration the time necessary to setup and configure controllers. Not only does setup time increase but you could then possibly need a bigger cabinet to hold everything, larger fans for cooling, larger switches, more power, etc. All of which increases costs. Next is the troubleshooting. When something doesn't work where do you start? The more parts you have, the greater something will act up. In business, service calls loses money. Besides an unhappy client, the cost of a truck roll, time spent troubleshooting, replacing parts etc. means less time at another job. This makes for another unhappy client since their home gets delayed or missing out on me clients for to availability issues. At home, you may end up with an unhappy wife but every moment troubleshooting something means less time for family, friends, and yourself. While your comparison to AV systems is nice, i think it misses the mark. Separates work for AV because of the amount of things a processor needs to do at once. Off-loading some of the work to amps improves performance because of the load that is required for everything. Using separate systems for everything with HA is akin to having a separate box for Dolby Vision, a separate one for HDR10, one for HDR+, another for Dolby Atmos, and one for Auro 3D. The same applies for routers and modems. Many people use them successfully together without issues. Most people recommend separate router and modem because the combos generally suck in regards to features and flexibility. For starters, the line into the house for the modem may not be in the best place. Having a separate router can enable a person to place the router in the optimal location. In general, a router needs to be upgraded more often than a person's modem do having them be separate allows for that as well. With HA, outside of zwave, most system updates simply require a firmware update vs needing a new controller or radio. Even if you include zwave, since every device has to be of the same series to take advantage of upgrades, swapping to a newer board just because makes zero sense unless a person plans on swapping out all of their devices as well. Lastly, controlling HA devices is not processor intensive unlike AV equipment and Network equipment. This is why 10 years later the 994 is still humming along just fine doing what it does. To me, what you may gain from having separate controllers for each radio is lost by a bigger margin due to the experience you have. Every trigger has to travel through your network (router), then to the controller for that radio, which then processes the information and sends the commands to the devices- and back again. I just don't see how that improves upon a system that processes everything right there and sends out the commands to devices directly.

As soon as the last thread dies a new one pops up starting the whole debate all over again. What technology a person chooses for the future is irrelevant since anything can take over at anytime. Figure out what controller you want to use and go with products that work with it. Reality is that there are no perfect standards. Every single one has their own pros and cons. It's really up to the individual to decide what matters most to them and what fits into what they need. While asking on forums is nice, all you'll end up getting is what fits each individual that responds. Take myself for example. Im all about simplicity, aesthetics, and experience. Because of that, the only 3 protocols I'd use are insteon, Control 4, and Radio Ra2. While there are some aesthetically pleasing zwave switches, zwave still misses the mark on simplicity and experience by a large amount making it a non starter for me. Insteon does meet all 3 of my minimum criteria so they're part of my list. While the old line has grown long in the tooth on design, the new is infinitely better looking. In addition to looks, the feel and response is top notch. In regards to simplicity, all devices can be controllers, responders, give status, etc. There's no guessing game or parameters to concern yourself with. Everything just works with each other. If insteon were to shut down in the next 5 years, my stuff would still be working. Their existence changes nothing about my home. If it shits down in 10. So what!!! Same thing. My house will still work and when it stops, it's cheap enough that I'm ok with swapping them out for something else. With Ra2, their protocol is second to none. If set up properly, they'll work forever without fail. While looks are subjective for their basic switches, they do have others that look really good. While Ra2 is limited programming wise, the Isy changes that (after all we're talking about using the Isy). The Ra2 lighting experience is amazing (as it should be since Lutron invented the dimmer). The icing on the cake is that it can be used with other controllers as well so you still have other options in the future. The downside is price. Depending on needs, the free course may be enough. If not, the advanced course costs. However, it's cheaper to spend the 650 or so that it costs than it is to pay someone to do it for you. Still device cost and training is an additional expense that limits most people. For me, C4 has the aesthetics, it's simple to program, and the experience is amazing as well (though not as amazing as Lutron). In addition, it's ability to be integrated with A/V naturally, makes it even better. Just like RA2, the downside is that it's installer only. Tuya and other wifi devices should be a non-starter for any serious HA enthusiast. All of those cheap things are extremely limited long term due to lack of scalability and flexibility. The power of any system resides in the controller not the devices so that does help with tuya and other wifi based devices but they can only do so much. I would recommend looking at all the options the Isy supports (if this is the controller of choice) and research each one's pros and cons to see what fits your needs

No. Not something that's possible to do at this time. Even if it were possible, since they haven't released an API i don't see anyone writing a nodeserver for those devices

Finally got something right. ?

No. That's not possible at least at this time. The firmware can be updated so it's something that could potentially happen in the future

Oh well! There goes that thought

13 more posts to 1000. WE CAN DO IT!!!! ***12 more after this one

You're welcome. There's also a Flexible rubber version if you're going around bends. Good for behind the tv

Get an aluminum diffuser. Looks cleaner and you don't get the led reflection. Muzata 6-Pack 3.3ft 9x17mm U Shape LED Aluminum Channel System with Cover, End Caps and Mounting Clips Aluminum Profile for LED Strip Light Installations Diffuser U1SW WW 1M, LU1 https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01M09PBYX/ref=cm_sw_r_apan_glt_fabc_BTWYMHP7AKV5QJ3JVCCW

I use hue. There are a multitude of ways to do this. You can hardwire a strip to your cabinets or use something the isy supports via a nodeserver

They will update their status in the Isy if queried.

To clarify some of what Teken said, the Isy will add the devices as unsupported devices. What they are will not show up. You can control devices from the console as far as turning them on, off, and dimming (dimmable devices). The Isy will not display status of the devices if manually controlled. Each switch can be a dimmer or a relay. You would not be able to switch modes. The kpl and dial, are both dimmers by default while the paddle is a relay so all would stay in their default mode. I forgot to add that only the main button on the kpl shows up as well as only the main outlet on the dual outlet

I'm the opposite. I want to automate as much as possible. I don't need notifications about what the system is doing since I programmed it to do it. I want notifications for what it's not able to do such as if the locks aren't working or doesn't lock. If I'm going to spend more time confirming stuff happened, then i might as well continue doing stuff on my own. If automating something can cause more harm than it solves, then i don't automate it. Important stuff that is automated are still handled manually first. The system only kicks in when should we fail to do it outselves. For example, I'll still close my garage doors when I leave or come home. However, it's possible that I forget so that's when the system takes over. Same goes for door locks.

The train conductor normally handles operations and safety when it comes to the train. He may also be an engineer if it's a small metro style system but at least here in the US, the conductor and engineer are separate roles. I'm with you in that at 200 miles per hour, there's not much we can do

What are you talking about? I've already stated every argument you're making now. The only thing we differ on is whether it'll be possible. Just because something may be done for safety doesn't mean it's not possible